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Final Call: Beasley or Rose?



June 13 08
This is a special feature from guest blogger John Nguyen.

Since June 26, 2008 can’t come soon enough, it’s time to decide who the best fit is for the Bullies. When the basketball Gods granted us the number one pick, the majority of Chicago and hardcore basketball fans smelled “Roses.” As we’re getting closer to the draft day by day, people are beginning to hop on the Beasley wagon. I can’t blame anyone because both kids look great although I preferred Rose in another article (http://www.hoopsvibe.com/nba-blog/nba-b ... orum132172) but now I’m thinking even more in depth before I rush judgment. This is not a no-brainer like I previously thought. There is no Lebron or Oden here.
Hear me out, please.

I’ll examine who best fits Chicago’s long term plans with the roster without listing trades because, well, trades are for fantasy leaguers. There’s no need to list any trade because there’s too many possibilities. I will not address Larry Hughes because we’re probably stuck with his filthy contract. He should be gone of the highest order. I will not address Andres Nocioni because he should be traded, too. He’s a straight ball hogging shot jacker.

I will explain who would needs to leave although I know there will be disagreements on who should go or stay, but in the end, I’m writing this. Not you. As of this writing, Vinny Del Negro is the Bulls head coach. I really do not think he is leaning one way or the other. He prefers size in prospects (Beasley), but he is a disciple of D’Antoni’s offense (Rose). Please note that when I have a top 3 pick of any draft, I definitely take the best possible player overall regardless of position and definitely regardless of who’s on the team. Bobby Knight once said, “Take Michael Jordan and play him at center.”

If Michael Beasley is selected:
This automatically makes Ben Gordon untouchable because we need another proven 21+ per game scorer to compliment Beasley. John Paxson cannot let him sign the qualifying offer, trade him, or let him walk for nothing. He is that important now. Fans have been complaining for a big low post scorer for the past 5 years. Here he is.
Beasley’s offensive IQ is unreal and a great rebounder to boot. He can hit the J from anywhere, post up against anyone, and cross over defenders in isolation; ball handling skills are great for a kid his size. It’s a plus that he can spot the double teams coming and still manage to score. He has the tools to become a solid defender, but will that ever come to fruition? Is he too much of a practical joker to be a leader? Does he have the desire to become the best? Is he a black hole? As we all know those questions are the things that will hold him back from a good player to being a great player. That’s something that Beasley has to fix himself. If he is everything that is advertised, he will open up the perimeter for Gordon to do his damage. That jumper now looks as easy as a layup. Whether he’s in Chicago or where ever, Beasley has the strongest chance to be Rookie of the Year. I can definitely see BG hitting 25+ppg with him; a sick inside-outside duo.

Kirk Hinrich can probably stay as well but the problem here is already confirmed by Ric Bucher of ESPN: the team doesn’t want him to be the point guard. They rather have Chris Duhon. This is major news. We cannot ignore this stuff. Again, let’s not question Bucher’s credibility either. Yes, Kobe didn’t play his last game as a Laker as reported. Yes, Doug Collins didn’t become head coach. But really, everybody jumped the gun on both things anyway. The truth is Bucher’s sources failed him. But for him to slide in that little nugget confirms my suspicions on what I saw in many games; Hinrich not favored by the team speaks volumes especially as the supposed captain.

Kirk’s not a point guard, but he’s a nice role player. He still over dribbles, makes defensive mistakes leading to stupid fouls, whines too much, doesn’t know how to feed the hot hand, can’t penetrate, has turned into a mediocre shooter, and cannot answer to adversity. Furthermore, his calling card was defense. That’s thrown out the window with him playing putrid defense all year. When he’s getting smoked by Cuttino Mobley, Chris Quinn, and Travis Diener, we have major problems. Ben Wallace was the worst player on the roster, but after the trade deadline, Hinrich became the worst player. He had many games where he registered only 2-4 assists. That’s completely unacceptable for a point guard of his caliber; truly unacceptable.

So if fans are willing to overlook that, might as well “think out of the box” as Paxson and Del Negro like to put it in the press conference, and let Ben Gordon be the starting point guard with Beasley in the mix. We can’t do any worse than what Kirk put up all season. C’mon, his assist average has been decreasing each year just like his contract. If he stays under this scenario, there will be more locker room hatred. Paxson is not going to want that happening again. Expect Pax to look to trade him even with Beasley drafted.

Will Hinrich bounce back? I don’t see it happening on this team because the majority of the players do not respect him. In effect, Hinrich will hate the team and not pass the ball around. This information has gotten public so Kirk, in essence, will think “I see how it is. Screw you guys” and look for his shot a lot than ever before. He will still suck balls as usual and be detrimental to the ballclub. The time is to move him now before his value dips even lower than where it is currently. Let’s face it. John Paxson soured on Hinrich a long time ago, guys. That’s been confirmed earlier this season in a radio interview.

Deng, Thabo, and Noah surround Beasley just fine. If Beasley starts to become the Rookie of the Year that he’s being hyped then Tyrus Thomas or Drew Gooden will be gone. There’s a log jam and one guy has to be moved to make room for Beasley to avoid splitting minutes and locker room politics. Here’s another thought: if Beasley excels at the small forward spot since he’s a tweener forward, Deng will have to be traded in the future.

If Derrick Rose is selected:
This is the end for Hinrich. Derrick Rose is alpha male at point guard. Many fans have completely written off a Rose/Gordon backcourt, which is understandable because of the height and Gordon’s problem of guarding the two. But again, try thinking outside the box and experiment with that starting guard tandem before completely abandoning it. That’s why they the play games, right? At least give them a season before deciding to trade Gordon and putting in Thabo as the starting guard. He’s earned that right to prove himself with the organization and the fans. What do we have to lose, guys? Honestly, we have nothing to lose. We’re a bottom feeding team at 33 wins, 49 loses. Remember that.

What’s that I hear? Hinrich can play the two spot? Oh hell no. That’s already been proven under Skiles. He still deferred back to Gordon. That’s not a possibility. And it shouldn’t be.

Here’s a worst case scenario: the entire current backcourt has to be traded away to rebuild around Rose because of Pax’s mistake of drafting too many combo guards. The only player staying is Thabo yet even he isn’t the ideal SG. I just don’t see him as a long term starting big guard. He’s only a temporary fix because he cannot produce much offense. His dribbling is suspect and jumpshot is awful. He cannot take anyone off the dribble in isolation and that’s crucial at that position. If he was like a young Michael Finley, then hell yes, I start him. Yet then again, he’s currently playing like today’s Michael Finley.
If we suck again next season, hopefully we can land Deromar DeRozen from USC. Trade away Gordon to get a good big man in return and have a Rose/DeRozen backcourt with Thabo backing up at both 2 and 3 spots. I’m pretty sure we’re not going to suck again next season for this to happen, but this depends on Deng’s and Gordon’s contract situations.

Tyrus Thomas should not be traded unless Miami wants Hinrich and Tyrus for Beasley. Then by all means, do the trade. I’ll commit that. But anyway, he should stay for one more season and hopefully he becomes Shawn Marion-like. He’ll be catching lobs having easy scoring opportunities all game. Under Rose, this thinking can be applied to all of our bigs.

So finally, Beasley or Rose? Here’s a great link to check out, credits to YaoPau. http://www.blogabull.com/2008/6/4/54570 ... against-nb.

Both kids are great at their respective positions. They’ll be just fine in the league. I’m going to take it one step further to see who can be the greater player in the long run. Derrick Rose’s 6 game NCAA tourney averages: 35.5 mpg, 20.8 ppg, 6.5 rebs, 6.0 assists, 1.3 stls while maintaining 52% from the field and 77% at the stripe.
Beasley’s 2 game NCAA tourney averages: 33 mpg, 23 ppg, 12 rebs, 1 stl while maintaining 48% from the field and 88% at the stripe.

Beasley will be a fine player right from the start no doubt, but I think Rose will be the greater player in the long run because Rose is the better all around talent. Don’t get me wrong. Either kid makes the Bulls somewhat of a lock for the playoffs. The team still needs to do a trade or two by acquiring either kid. Another interesting thing to note: ever since 1990, no point guard selected within the top 5 has become a bust. The only thing closest was Jay Williams but we didn’t see enough to make that certain. In Beasley’s case, a lot of players roughly the same size, height and position have become busts in top 5 picks. History is hands down on Derrick Rose’s side. His selection serves another distinction: the last point guard to be taken number one overall was Magic Johnson in 1979. We’ll see what the Bulls do at the podium when they announce their selection.

On Ben Gordon’s contract disputes and 2010 plan:

Ben Gordon is the center of controversy on this ballclub because despite being the best player, he’s seeking too much money and fans nitpick on the usual cliché lack of height and defense. That’s too bad because I couldn’t care less about either one. BG has gotten better at challenging shots, but no one wants to see or admit it. We just love to stick with stereotypes because we’re mentally lazy.

He’s proven that he can get the job done even in the heat of criticism. Jerry Reinsdorf should be ready to overpay just a little bit for Gordon, preferably around Kevin Martin’s value at $55 million. If he’s signed to a similar offer of 5/$50 million then YOU START HIM NO MATTER WHAT regardless of Thabo’s length and defense. Sefolosha is not an established player even with the 15 games he flourished in last season. BG is a proven commodity, which makes him the starting SG.

This negotiation will be a long painful process. If Gordon still doesn’t like the offer then it’s time to trade him. Word on the street is that Reinsdorf does not even want to offer any type of extension but the QO is something both parties want to avoid and the salary dump is silly because we will not get back anything close to Gordon’s value. If Reinsdorf dumps Gordon or lets him walk into unrestricted territory, we’re back to a shitty franchise. We have passed being the Cavaliers of the 80s/90s. We became the Clippers of the East.

I see, as some do, that a core of Deng, Gordon, Beasley or Rose, Tyrus, and Noah with $20-$30 million in cap space has a great chance of attracting Lebron, Wade, or Chris Bosh in the 2010 free agent class. I’m sure that Pax is thinking the same. Will Reinsdorf make that happen? Is he even willing to? Does he share the same vision?

[image:http://farm1.static.flickr.com/39/88831321_574b46e19a_m.jpg]

12 Comments: Final Call: Beasley or Rose?

Posted by
2 jordan 3
on 09.18.2008
put michael jordan back then, youll see whats gonna happen,and also the rest of the team .
Posted by

on 09.18.2008
put michael jordan back then, youll see whats gonna happen .
Posted by
dknight22
on 06.22.2008
the bulls should trade their first pick to the heat for d wade then the heat wud have the top two picks .
Posted by

on 06.21.2008
no, writer is correct. Magic is last number one "pure" point guard. Iverson was never a pg hes an undersized sg. .
Posted by
Franchise
on 06.21.2008
overall, this is a great problem for the bulls to have. Beasley or rose? Great problem. But i’d have to go with rose Point Guards are limited especially in the eastern conference a good point guard gives your team an edge .
Posted by
Franchise
on 06.21.2008
well u have a mistake in your post. Allen Iverson was the last point guard to be drafted #1 overall(which was in 1996). I guess people classify him as an undersized shooting guard but he did play most of his career at point .
Posted by
Foxhound
on 06.17.2008
Get Hinrich off this fuckin’ team already!I’ve had enough of him! He stinks!Roses smell better. .
Posted by

on 06.14.2008
rose can run an offense and his vision is way better than kirk... have u seen kirk try n run a fast break... its horrible... beasly 20 10? k cool, but thats what we have Deng for.. Deng was supposed to be our All-Star, thats why we didnt trade him...My arguement is this.. Deng scores on easy baskets.. his average increased when he stoppped shooting 3s... with Deng cutting and someone like Rose findihing him... Deng should scor emore and be more consistent.. higher percentage...between Deng, Hughes and if we Keep Gordon.. all should score 20+.. then rose getting 10+... thats pretty good...I think bulls right now if we draft Rose, has more parts to move in Guards to trade for a Big Guy if they wanted .
Posted by
Sam
on 06.14.2008
There is absolutely no evidence what to speak of about hinrich not being liked by the bulls anymore. He had a bad season like every other player on that team. When someone like Shaq talks about Hinrich the way he did below, speaks volumes about Hinrich. So all you Hinrich haters, backoff!Shaq likes Beasley: During a visit with Mike North on WSCR 670-AM on Friday, Phoenix center Shaquille O’Neal recommended the Bulls choose Michael Beasley with the No. 1 draft pick, but for reasons that may seem surprising."I’m going to go with the 20 and 10 guy," O’Neal said. "Because I think Kirk Hinrich is one of the top 12 point guards in the league. He’s consistent, very unselfish, can play defense and can shoot the ball."I think his shot is way better than Derrick Rose’s shot. Derrick Rose is much faster, he’s more athletic. But I think in that position, from my experience, you want a guy that really gets off the ball like Kirk does and gets everyone else involved." .
Posted by
ERob’s Ghost
on 06.14.2008
To imitable, You haven’t been following the Bulls closely. Paxson does not like Hinrich that much anymore. Don’t know where you’ve been all season. Live in denial much? Pax has been trying to deal him since last year even in the Kevin Garnett deal.Antonio Daniels? Please read the article again. he said "point guards." Not combo guards. Daniels is not a true point guard. Have you even seen him play?You seem offended. Too bad. he can’t please everyone. Beasley or Rose? the writer had to answer that question once and for all. he had to take a side. Please re-read the article VERY closely word for word. .
Posted by
Inimitable ’94
on 06.13.2008
I think it should be noted that there have only been point guards drafted in the top 5 since 1990, and that’s probably because its such a risk. Also, Antonio Daniels, drafted 4th in the 1997 draft, hardly reached his potential, and I believe it’s safe to call him a bust. No one drafts someone 4th overall and expects them to be an average role player. Also from 1990 to 2004, there were only 9 pgs drafted. That’s 9 out of 75 selections were used on pgs. Also, not only do I not buy your argument that Hinrich has fallen out of favor with Paxson, it’s completely unproven. Sure the Bulls are upset with his performance of the past year, but they do want to keep him, and there is no evidence to the contrary. But as you said, they don’t want to play him at the 1 anymore. Most likely to leave at the guard spot is Ben Gordon, it’s pretty obvious that you’re pretty crazy over him. He’s hardly 5’11 (you can find his height listed when he was measured for the draft) and therefore a defensive liability guarding the 2. Not to mention he doesn’t even do a good job guarding the 1. He’s a bad defender, plain and simple. Secondly, the Bulls are still happy with Thabo. He’s a big guard who plays defense and improved his offensive abilities over the past season. In his last 41 games (the 2nd half of the season), he averaged around 10 pts and 3 ast in a little more than 20 mpg. I definitely think thats improvement. Another thing, the bulls WOULD NOT rather have Chris Duhon than Hinrich. It is widely known that the Bulls have no intentions on pursuing Chris Duhon. I really like Duhon, but the Bulls have no intention at all to keep the small guard who can’t shoot. Duhon is expected to walk during free-agency, unless the Bulls make some moves to move nearly all of their guards and are in need of him, which isn’t very likely. Now, Tyrus Thomas. You say he shouldn’t be traded unless you can package him for Beasley. You give no reason why Thomas shouldn’t be traded. He has absolutely no offensive game besides dunking, and one of the last guys with a bulls uniform to be only good at dunking was released (Eddie Robinson). He is undoubtedly a good defensive talent, but he has failed to develop offensively. I’m not arguing that we should give up on him, but I do not believe that he should not be traded unless for Beasley, which is a ridiculous statement when considering how very unlikely it is.A reason that BG shouldn’t be overpaid is not only for his lack of height and defense, but his inconsistency. He has never proven to be a consistent scorer. Last season, only 4 time did he score 20+ppg in 3 consecutive games. 3 times it was a string of 3 games, and once it was a string of 5 games. So if he’s proven inconsistent, bad on defense, and at a disadvantage from being about a half a foot shorter than most guards in the league, WHY give him a big contract. And another thing, after being in the league for 4 seasons, it is UNACCEPTABLE to be patted on the back for "getting better at challenging someone’s shot". That’s complete and total BS (I know thats redundant)!! I dont buy that argument of yours.And not to target you, because everyone seems to be doing this, but there is no way we can guarantee that a 6’8 235lb kid will be dominating immediately at the next level. No way possible. He’s not going to be able to immediately make Gordon be able to average over 25ppg in the NBA. If he’s that good, all they have to do is put a bigger guy on him, and there are tons of them in the NBA. On a nightly basis he will be facing more experienced, taller, bigger and stronger players. I just cant conceive why everyone is so sold that this kid is gonna come in and dominate. He’s smaller than some 2 guards, in height and weight!!! Although I’ve pretty much painted the picture that size is very important, it isn’t the only thing. But i think its a big enough obstacle that it wont allow him to immediately just dominate his opponents.Also, you say you’re going to examine how each of the draft choices will be in the long term, but it seems you did this in only one sentence.. "Beasley will be a fine player right from the start no doubt, but I think Rose will be the greater player in the long run because Rose is the better all around talent". .
Posted by
Chi-Burbs
on 06.13.2008
if we let BG walk... at leas tets trad ehim and kirk to clippers for Cory... Rose, Cory, Deng, Tyrus, Noah is pretty filthy..I mean, id trade hughes, gordon and kirk for Cory .

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Oly Sandor

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Oly Sandor

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Oly Sandor is an NBA analyst and sports journalist based out of Vancouver, Canada.After years of the free-lance game, Oly Sandor is bringing his unique brand of NBA analysis exclusively to (...) More